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352nd US mass shooting this year.





0
 12.03.2015 4:59am
Thread Creator

Megz
Capital M before egz



So - the US has just suffered its 352nd mass shooting this year. Initial reports suggest 14 victims and at least 14 others wounded. Police chasing down three suspects - two now confirmed dead.

http://www.stuff.co.nz/world/americas/74698735/california-shooting-disability-centre-no-threat-to-anybody

Obama took a pretty firm stance after the UCC shooting, which was good to see as an outsider. Being outside of the US it is hard to understand the internal politics of gun control but it's reassuring to see that the president is making efforts and voicing his concerns over the lack of control and the disgustingly high rate of mass murder.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qCwJzWHNmAk

I hope that the US can soon inact some meaningful change and reduce the number of these tragedies - it's appalling to see such hate and anger pouring out against innocent muslims due to the actions of a radical few overseas while you have "ordinary" citizens killing more of your own people within your own borders and there is little being done to curb the homegrown acts of terror.



Sugar. Short AND sweet.




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0
 12.03.2015 6:15am


Id82
Fuck Shit Stack.



Not only that but there was another Mass shooting today in Savannah Georgia as well. Not as tragic but another shooting none the less. I have no idea why but mass shootings have gone up exponentially in just the past year. Along with more well organized spree murders.
I have no idea if there is any correlation with the conservative media and these shootings seeing as all the media does in this country is try to scare the crap out of old people for ratings. My conservative father in law's first thought is to blame Obama for everything that is going on.

Nothings really going to change not as long as the NRA has money and power and keeps spotting bullshit like "Guns don't kill people, people kill people" and "A good guy with a gun can stop a bad gun with a gun." Yeah where are all of these "Good Guys" stopping all of these bad guys?




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0
 12.03.2015 11:04pm


Call
Firefightin' Administrator
Administrator



California has some of the strictest gun laws in the nation.  The type of weapons used are banned specifically in that state.  What good did it do?  Chicago is a war zone, and they probably DO have the strictest gun laws.  I still believe we should blame the individual and not the method, but there is such outcry when events like this occur that I'm aware the opinion isn't popular. directly after the aftermath.

And...good guys with guns did stop the rampage.  The "militarized" police force had just enough force to end it.  

Near where I live, a man disarmed and detained an armed robber a few days back in  a busy restaurant  I'm not saying the idiot was going to start shooting patrons, but he also never had the chance to do so.  You didn't hear about that on the national media.

I lean far to the conservative side of things (I've seen plenty of legitimate need in my community, but I've also seen a hell of a lot of project and other slum apartments with nicer material things than I own, which tells me something...) but I detest Fox News and MSNBC equally.  I do not consider either to be "news" and instead know they are the shameless mouthpieces of either side.

Plain and simple, making something illegal will not stop a person from using that something if they want to use it badly enough. 







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0
 12.04.2015 3:08am


KyleIII
Registered Member



http://www.theonion.com/article/no-way-prevent-says-only-nation-where-regularly-ha-51938




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0
 12.04.2015 3:45am


Fun
YES! WE! ARE!



Call said:

California has some of the strictest gun laws in the nation.  The type of weapons used are banned specifically in that state.  What good did it do?  Chicago is a war zone, and they probably DO have the strictest gun laws.  I still believe we should blame the individual and not the method, but there is such outcry when events like this occur that I'm aware the opinion isn't popular. directly after the aftermath.

The problem is that no matter how strict the gun laws are in those places, it's just a hop, skip and a jump to the next place where you can grab one with ease. The laws don't make things hard, butchering the supply line because of the laws does. That's not happening in America (thanks to the miracle of a buck to be made).

And...good guys with guns did stop the rampage.  The "militarized" police force had just enough force to end it.

Near where I live, a man disarmed and detained an armed robber a few days back in  a busy restaurant  I'm not saying the idiot was going to start shooting patrons, but he also never had the chance to do so.  You didn't hear about that on the national media.

This is as bad as teaching abstinence only in sex ed classes. It might stop one or two cases, but its never going to have a realistic impact on the problem.

Plain and simple, making something illegal will not stop a person from using that something if they want to use it badly enough. 

Again, the point of making things illegal is the severly cut the supply line of those illegal things. Sure, serious crims will still get their hands on assault rifles, but no reasonable person would rather they get them from a corner store instead of a complex smuggling ring that could be busted by a police raid at a moment's notice.

KyleIII said:

http://www.theonion.com/article/no-way-prevent-says-only-nation-where-regularly-ha-51938

http://www.betootaadvocate.com/uncategorized/australia-enjoys-another-peaceful-day-under-oppressive-gun-control-regime/




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0
 12.04.2015 3:50am


Id82
Fuck Shit Stack.



I'm not saying we should get rid of guns or make them illegal. It's already far too late for that. But there needs to be some responsibility taught to gun owners, and people need to learn to respect the weapons they own.
No one complains when you have a car and you have to register it, get a liscense to drive it, insure it and yourself and even get a deed to own it in your name.
It should be the same for a gun. These are not toys, and there should be some responsibility to owning one. Classes, a liscense and test, required time at a gun range, something.

I don't think the solution is to make them illegal. But something needs to be done, whether making it more difficult to attain a gun or more psychological screening. From what I understand most of these mass shootings were done by people who legally purchased these fire arms, and weren't considered criminals until they did what they did. It's too easy to get guns in some states, so its easy to carry a weapon over state lines where theres harsher gun laws anyways.  To say we shouldn't do anything because bad people will do bad things is like giving up before even trying, and then just accepting it again when another mass shooting happens.
Breaking into a house is illegal, so we shouldn't put locks on our doors because criminals will break in if they want to badly enough?




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0
 12.04.2015 12:50pm


Call
Firefightin' Administrator
Administrator



Mass shootings aside, more people are killed yearly in plain old "I got pissed at somebody and decided to shoot them after they walked out of the club" incidents.  Mass shootings are only popular news because of the fact that national media and politicians can use them for their own benefit.  Othrwise, you'd hear as much about them as any shooting in Chicago or Detroit or Miami or wherever.  They're brought up and argued over because of their magnitude.  

As far as making something illegal "cutting a supply line," ask me how many times we gave Narcan for heroin overdoses the other day at work.  If the police can bust a smuggling ring at a moment's notice, why is there any crime?  The police don't have a chance against the drug trade, and would have just as much chance against a gun ring.  And I'm not downing the police!  I love the police, my brother-in-law is a US Marshal.  Often, their hands are tied.

And Id82, responsibility needs to be taught to gun owners?  Not to responsible gun owners.  If someone is going to commit a crime, they'll do it regardless.  I own a gun, and I'm not going to take it out of this house.  No other gun owner I know who is "responsible" has any plans on using his weapon for evil purposes, whatever they may be.  More psychological screenings?  Fine.  More background checks?  Fine.  But not everyone gets their weapons legally at a gun store.  There are private sales all the time, which require no checks whatsoever.  In the united States, the genie is out of the bottle.

In the United States, this isn't a question of gun control.  It's a question of how we value life.  If someone doesn't value life, they're going to disregard all moral standards and find a way to murder people.  It's parenting.  It's social norms.  It's what makes humans human.  If you don't value life, and you want to destroy it, you'll find a way to do so, whether it's going Timothy McVeigh or Unabomber or Boston Marathon, or shooting up a school or business.  Take away their guns.  Fine.  They can get pressure cooker bomb instructions off the internet or out of Inspire Magazine.

 It's the beginning of the degradation of our society in the United States, and to expect people who truly own weapons for their own protection to simply give up their weapons when these assholes are out there running around with guns is crazy talk.  I wouldn't do it.  And up until a few years ago, I couldn't understand why anyone would want a gun.  It changes with whatever your world-view is.  I started seeing things go bad out there in the streets, and that was all I needed.




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0
 12.04.2015 1:15pm


Fun
YES! WE! ARE!



Call said:

Mass shootings aside, more people are killed yearly in plain old "I got pissed at somebody and decided to shoot them after they walked out of the club" incidents.  Mass shootings are only popular news because of the fact that national media and politicians can use them for their own benefit.  Othrwise, you'd hear as much about them as any shooting in Chicago or Detroit or Miami or wherever.  They're brought up and argued over because of their magnitude.

Also part of the problem. Availability of guns. 

As far as making something illegal "cutting a supply line," ask me how many times we gave Narcan for heroin overdoses the other day at work.  If the police can bust a smuggling ring at a moment's notice, why is there any crime?  The police don't have a chance against the drug trade, and would have just as much chance against a gun ring.  And I'm not downing the police!  I love the police, my brother-in-law is a US Marshal.  Often, their hands are tied.

Allow me to clarify what I meant here: there is a burden on the smuggler to keep things clandestine, which requires some effort, lest the police become aware and take steps to prevent the smuggling operation. The harder the police make it for smugglers, the lesser the supply, the lesser the related crime. I never meant to imply that the police were capable of magically stopping crimes whenever they happened!

Again, those desperate enough will get their hands on guns, but due to the difficulty you're going to see a hell of a lot less Sandy Hooks and the like. In fact, almost certainly none at all, iirc that Sandy Hook guy (or one of them, who the fuck can even keep track of them all, fucking hell) stole at least one of his guns from his mother, perfectly legally acquired, would pass any proposed safety / responsibility checks. Much like your own, I'd imagine.

Again, availability.




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0
 12.05.2015 6:45am


KyleIII
Registered Member








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0
 12.05.2015 8:51pm


Jaran
I'm going to try SCIENCE!



But then she just has to shoot him so it's all good.




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0
 12.07.2015 5:31pm


Call
Firefightin' Administrator
Administrator



That's a SHE?!?

Anyway, you can kick someone out for smoking.  You can't kick someone out who brings a gun into a gun-free zone if they mean to do harm.




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0
 12.07.2015 5:41pm


Jaran
I'm going to try SCIENCE!



But if she kicks him out for smoking and he pulls out a gun then the smoking ban is also meaningless.




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