Street Fighter X Tekken

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10.25.2011 7:04am

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ManjiSanji
Insanity Mongoose

Omg best fighting game ever?

Seriously, this game looks like it'll be such a blast.

Who else is psyched?

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10.25.2011 7:27am

(Edited on 10.25.2011 at 7:34am)

Rhaegar
World Warrior 21007

I was hyped ... until the Gems bullshit came about.

Which means the only new fighting game I'm looking forward to at all right now is Tekken Tag Tournament 2 (at least that one's looking damn sexy). And I'm in wait-and-see mode on Ultimate Marvel vs. Capcom 3 (contingent entirely on the uber-broken touch-of-death combos from MvC3 being excised).

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10.25.2011 7:39am

JSG
Registered Member

I'm hoping the gems are optional or something, because I really wanted this game until I heard about them.

On the other hand, it IS one less fighter to divide my time between. Between Third Strike, Ultimate Marvel, King of Fighters XIII, and Skullgirls, I'll have my hands full trying to juggle fighters without throwing SFxT into the mix.

Although if Zafina is in it I'll probably get hype all over again.

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10.25.2011 7:42am

Rhaegar
World Warrior 21007

JSG said:

I'm hoping the gems are optional or something, because I really wanted this game until I heard about them.

They're not optional.

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10.25.2011 7:46am

JSG
Registered Member

That sucks.

But those teaser images have Zafina in them.

Damn. I am torn.

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10.25.2011 2:40pm

CaButler
Winter Knight of the Unseelie Court

I had no real interest in the game. Now, hearing about the gem thing? I'll stick with Blazblue and King of Fighters this year, thank you very much.

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10.25.2011 3:11pm

Amer
pew pew pew

The only thing that makes me care about this game is Poison.

Yeah, I'm shallow.

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10.25.2011 5:31pm

JSG
Registered Member

I was really excited about Poison but her playstyle doesn't look like something I'd enjoy. I'll still give her a shot if I do end up getting the game but after seeing her in action I'm not nearly as hopeful.

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10.25.2011 11:52pm

Spidey
So Sigh Ety

What's wrong with the gems? Seems like a pretty cool idea to me.

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10.26.2011 12:12am

Rhaegar
World Warrior 21007

The article I linked in my first post explains much of what's wrong with it. But tl;dr version:

While the possibility of creating a "custom ISM/Groove" (if you will) sounds cool, it comes with a host of problems, such as the possibility of way too many menus at the character select screen before every fight. This really slows down the flow of action, particularly at tournaments. And, yes, another serious issue is the fact that many of the gems will have to be bought as DLC, which is just another example of Capcom's recent money-grubbing fetish, and again raises the question of what to allow and not allow at tournaments.

And, finally, yeah, the gems do look pretty damn retarded in-game:

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10.26.2011 12:23am

JSG
Registered Member

It could create huge problems for tournament play, for one thing.

Personally I like a game where I can learn matchups and characters without a bunch of customization and extraneous stuff to keep track of. Matchup knowledge could definitely suffer if Ryu with these gems is wildly different from Ryu with these other gems, and so forth, making the game too much of a chore to learn. Plus, with apparently hundreds of gems, it could take forever to optimize your own characters, going through a ton of experiments.

Why not just play a game like KOF13 or Skullgirls or something where I don't have to do all that? I want a fighter I can take out of the box (or download) and just play and learn it right there.

Gems could upset balance, matchups, and potentially everything else. And that would take away from how fun it is, plus how viable it is competitively. Especially if they're DLC.

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10.26.2011 12:46am

Ashilyn
Career GM

I think the whole Gem thing will be a lot of fun if you're just playing for fun, rather than competatively. That said, it does put me off from buying the game at launch - if I'm not getting a fighting game to play it competatively with friends or in tournaments, I'm not paying full price for it.

I don't hate them for the same reason I never hated items in Super Smash Brothers - if you're just playing to mess around with friends, particularly in a casual party or get together atmosphere, they might be a lot of fun. We won't really know for sure until we know more about the game. But that's about the only time I see them being fun.

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10.26.2011 6:47pm

(Edited on 10.26.2011 at 6:55pm)

Spidey
So Sigh Ety

Yeah, it would have been nice to turn them off for tournaments. I can see why they are a pain for tournament goers. but as a non tournament goer, I will find them very fun. I like the idea that the Ryu matchup can be one of 5 different matchups. It can create more emphasis on adapting and less on pre determined knowledge of the matchup. When I play fighting games, I simply adjust to how my opponent plays, sometimes ignoring what the character can do, I look at my opponents habits and so forth. With more importance on this, I think i'd have more fun. I've been more intrigued about this game since I heard about them. I think you should keep an open mind, it could work out really well if tournies find a way to deal with them. There are a hundred other fighters out there well suited for tournies - why not take a gamble on this one and see if makes them even better?

I can understand thinking they may be bad or could pose problems, but you guys are acting like they are definitely a bad idea, when you haven't really tried it out yet. The only thing even remotely similar in a competitive fighter so far has been the GG system which is incredibly fun AND competitive.

If Gem's are DLC, then yeah, that's insanely stupid. But I think the system itself outside of getting gems by paying for them has a chance of really working out.

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10.26.2011 7:38pm

JSG
Registered Member

I'm not going to COMPLETELY write it off without seeing or hearing more, but I don't think it's a good thing. I was listening to something last night that put my complaints better than I could - gems change a lot of what's inherently fun about a fighter, and that's that things are nice and even at the start. And that's that without things like this, Ryu is Ryu is Ryu is ALWAYS Ryu. If you pick him, if I pick him, if an Evo champion picks him, it's always the same Ryu, and the match comes down to a test of skill and who can play better, since there's no inherent advantage in a gem setup or anything. It's just a matter of practice and playing better. Gems change that aspect of fighters. Maybe they could be fun, it depends on what they do, but I don't like the idea of losing the level playing field that not having them gives. I know that no combination of gems could allow me to beat, say, Justin Wong or somebody, but it will definitely skew things, especially when playing among equals, or trying to get better at the game. IIRC Ono was talking about a gem that allowed you to auto-block something at the cost of a meter, which could eliminate the need to practice and get better at blocking, etc. Kind of a case of buying your way through instead of learning and practicing, when it comes to DLC gems (and this is Capcom, you KNOW there's gonna be a ton of those).

Still, with a bunch of other fighters coming out that don't have a mandatory gem system, it's hard to imagine I'll spring for SFxT right away. Maybe after a price drop or two unless they do something to really, REALLY entice me between now and March. I'm not ruling out the possibility, but I'm not optimistic.

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10.26.2011 11:28pm

(Edited on 10.26.2011 at 11:38pm)

Spidey
So Sigh Ety

I don't think fighers are even at all. From a psychological perspective, the only difference is that instead of 40 characters, there are 4000 characters. It was never even. Somoene using Sagat was going to beat someone using Vega about 95% of the time. The only "even matches" are between two people using the same characters, and now the only even matches are between two people using the same characters and same gems. The only problem is that now instead of having all the characters available fairly, some people get an advantage because they have more money to spend. The problem is the DLC, not the gems themselves.

Tiers have always existed in fighters. If you wanted a fair chance at beating somoene, you had to pick a character equal or higher on the tier list. Otherwise you were facing an uphill battle. It's the same deal? I really can't see the problem besides tournaments running slower and DLC.

I can understand the frustration, but I honestly think it's an issue not with the concept of gems and altering characters, but the concept of paying for them, or their application (not having quick sets to choose from, or having too many gem combinations to choose from) I don't think the concept is any more unbalanced than the natural tier list.

Just imagine that the game was programmed with 40,000 character skins, and everytime you choose a different gem combination, it picks the skin for that combination. It's basically like having 40,000 characters. What Capcom's done is made it impossible to make a tier list or to figure out who the best characters are. I think it's brilliant. I agree with the problem of slowness and DLC, so I'm still undecided whether this is a good idea, but that's more to do with its application than the concept.

Trust me, I know how it is to have tournaments slowed down by people customizing too much shit. At Brawl tournmanets people would have to adjust their Wii motes, sync them to the Wii, change their controls (which it didn't let you save) and a bunch of crap that slows tournamnets to three times the length of Melee tournaments. So time is indeed a concern.

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