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Square Enix President stepping down [Kotaku]

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0

03.27.2013 3:58am

kjonez
with a Z

FFVI. Copy. Paste.

I agree that the pop culture references are very influential but the main thing that's lacking is a universal story(meaning anoyone in this world can enjoy) with connecting characters. VI is a great example because it's an entirely fantasy world with story and characters that relate to that world. There are familiar elements in the game like medival settings, magic, steampunk-esque technology, etc. but overall it plays out on it's own. I don't look at Relm and think, oh yeah that's just like the teenage girl that does such and such. No. It's a character who belongs in FFVI.

It's hard to write stroy and characters these days and really, I blame the advancements in technology(and also SE's close-mindness) because games HAVE to meet a certain graphcal quality. This quality standard is set so high now that the CG models, VO, etc. HAVE to match real life in order to continue capturing a large audience and not just us long time fans. Ain't gonna happen. Back in da dayz when we had text based dialouge and 16 bit sprites it was easier for our imagination to let the story and characters evolve with us more personally. There are many more factors that attribute to the decline of SE's products in the past decade, but I believe this is one of the main issues that they need to address and adapt to.

0

03.27.2013 4:34am

Fun
YES! WE! ARE!

Except VI's gameplay is uninspired ass - I appreciate the need for a good story in an RPG but I consider VI to be a cautionary tale against taking the Story-Gameplay dynamic to the wrong extreme.

0

03.27.2013 5:14am

SuperSquall
Shortening His Posts

^
Bullshit. It was the first proper ATB game (FFIV doesn't really count) of the series. If you view the game in retrospect it's gameplay is vanilla but only because FFVII, FFVIII, FFIX and Chrono Trigger all used improvements on the concepts that it pioneered.

Re: The big news: I don't see how things can get worse. Maybe remakes of FFVI and VII that desecrate the originals, but you know, I think we were on that course already.

0

03.27.2013 5:50am

Fun
YES! WE! ARE!

First "proper ATB game?" I'm vaguely aware of some mechanical differences, but for the most part VI's gameplay is just a rehash of IV at best and stock JRPG trash at worst. It has none of the difficulty of the previous installments (something it seems to have pioneered in the series, definitely) Its only pro is that it was the least terribly implemented of the SNES era.

Now, if they could make another story like that and innovate some good gameplay like, say, TWEWY, then maybe they might be able to climb out of their slump.

0

03.27.2013 6:46am

Thread Creator

Shadow
Comes and goes like the wind...

SuperSquall said:

^
Bullshit. It was the first proper ATB game (FFIV doesn't really count) of the series. If you view the game in retrospect it's gameplay is vanilla but only because FFVII, FFVIII, FFIX and Chrono Trigger all used improvements on the concepts that it pioneered.

Re: The big news: I don't see how things can get worse. Maybe remakes of FFVI and VII that desecrate the originals, but you know, I think we were on that course already.

Honestly SuperSquall,

I was going to respond to his comment earlier, but it's so ridiculous that I decided it wasn't even worth the effort. Saying Final Fantasy VI's gameplay is uninspired ass is like saying Super Mario World's side scrolling gameplay was uninspired.

I'm not sure how old "Fun" is, but I remember the kinds of games that were coming out in 1993 on the SNES and most of them were a million variations on the side scroller, so FFVI's gameplay was significantly more complex and well rounded than almost anything on the market. Either way, seems more like a trolling comment at this point.

0

03.27.2013 7:14am

Onyx
Butts
Administrator

SuperSquall said:

^
Bullshit. It was the first proper ATB game (FFIV doesn't really count) of the series. If you view the game in retrospect it's gameplay is vanilla but only because FFVII, FFVIII, FFIX and Chrono Trigger all used improvements on the concepts that it pioneered.

Uh, Final Fantasy V says hello even without your selective and bizarre disqualification of FFIV as a "true" ATB game. You couldn't be more wrong.

Either way, seems more like a trolling comment at this point.

"Person having opinion I don't like" is not trolling.

0

03.27.2013 7:39am

Fun
YES! WE! ARE!

Shadow said:

Either way, seems more like a trolling comment at this point.

Trolling isn't just putting an unpopular opinion out there. Though, for sure, I'm aware saying anything bad about VI on a fansite with older members such as here is going to draw some flak.

Since you're wondering, this is Australia which means mine was inevitably a Sega household. I can think of exactly two people (not an exaggeration) I knew who had an SNES.

0

03.27.2013 8:26am

shooter_mcgavin
Registered Member

Fun said:

Except VI's gameplay is uninspired ass - I appreciate the need for a good story in an RPG but I consider VI to be a cautionary tale against taking the Story-Gameplay dynamic to the wrong extreme.

VI's gameplay was fantastic besides the bugs and lack of balance. It did things that most FF lack, create a system that fully customizable (relics and espers) while allowing each character to have their individual uniqueness (special abilities and equipment). This allowed you to shuffle your party as you see fit for some nifty experimentation. Also plus points when you are in a dungeon that forces you to split your party.

0

03.27.2013 9:18am

Fun
YES! WE! ARE!

Odd definition of "fully customisable." Every character has a set list of abilities they'll eventually have unlimited access to - 99% of which are shared with everyone else. Given how useless the unique skills mostly are, choosing your party is less customising and more choosing which pixels looks the best.

Relics are a weak spot, too, considering that there's barely a handful that do anything other than change attributes/resistances like any other piece of equipment. Three of which are character specific and most of them are simply do more actions in a single round.

Espers are the height of VI's customization system but they're still weak. Compare "choose a single special attack per character + some discrete stat bonuses" to other entries in the series:

The "use it or lose it" stat system in FFII.
The job system in III/V
Materia in VII
Junctions in VIII
X had like equipment abilities or something, who even cares
Job/Subjob in XI
Paradigm in XIII

They each have their flaws, II and VIII especially. Even ignoring everything after VI you can still see that half of the series had something unique going for it. It's weak compared to its own standards. The first installment can be excused for not breaking the mold, IV revisited the concept with what Square'd learnt, but what excuse does VI have for being a throwback?

0

03.27.2013 2:38pm

(Edited on 03.27.2013 at 2:47pm)

Crisium
N/A

VI took how everyone was unique in IV, but also allowed almost them all to become powerful mages and master every spell (Gau, Umaro exceptions). They took the jobs from III and V and made them permanent, but not without their own unique twist. Sure you can say that Mog is a geomancer, Locke is a thief, and Umaro is a berserker, etc. But look at Sabin's unique take on a monk (button inputs), Swordtech for Cyan was unlike Samurai, Gau is completely unique and is neither blue mage nor beastmaster nor beserker, Celes' runic is unique and she's a capable offensive mage, etc. How do you even classify Edgar and his tools? He's no dragoon, but he can jump like one with the right setup.

The only flaw is that the game is too easy. It doesn't really matter if Cyan's base magic is crap. He can cast Ultima but he'll only do 7,000 damage or whatever instead of 9,999 like Relm. The Advance dungeon helps alleviate this, because if you didn't focus your esper level ups to help either strength or magic specifically you're gonna have trouble with your jack of all trades characters unless you spend all day levelling up. Of course when I replay the game these days I cheat to make it harder (set experience gained from battles to 0 for most battles, so that I rarely level up).

The game needs a proper hard mode, that's for sure. But when I play the Advance dungeon, everyone fills their unique role and mostly the mages are only ones casting offensive magic (most everyone heals though). Sabin only does Phantom Rush or the Wind Attack, Locke is X Attack, Edgar is Jump or maybe Chainsaw, Shadow is Throw, Gau and Umaro are on autopilot, etc. The game really shines then. Pheonix Cave and Kefka's tower also bring this out on lower level plays. I don't find the gameplay weak at all. I find it varied and compelling with 14 characters which is why I replay it more than any other game.

0

03.27.2013 5:43pm

amaron
No answer, must be that deaf bitch.

Crisium said:

VI took how everyone was unique in IV, but also allowed almost them all to become powerful mages and master every spell (Gau, Umaro exceptions). They took the jobs from III and V and made them permanent, but not without their own unique twist. Sure you can say that Mog is a geomancer, Locke is a thief, and Umaro is a berserker, etc. But look at Sabin's unique take on a monk (button inputs), Swordtech for Cyan was unlike Samurai, Gau is completely unique and is neither blue mage nor beastmaster nor beserker, Celes' runic is unique and she's a capable offensive mage, etc. How do you even classify Edgar and his tools? He's no dragoon, but he can jump like one with the right setup.

The only flaw is that the game is too easy. It doesn't really matter if Cyan's base magic is crap. He can cast Ultima but he'll only do 7,000 damage or whatever instead of 9,999 like Relm. The Advance dungeon helps alleviate this, because if you didn't focus your esper level ups to help either strength or magic specifically you're gonna have trouble with your jack of all trades characters unless you spend all day levelling up. Of course when I replay the game these days I cheat to make it harder (set experience gained from battles to 0 for most battles, so that I rarely level up).

The game needs a proper hard mode, that's for sure. But when I play the Advance dungeon, everyone fills their unique role and mostly the mages are only ones casting offensive magic (most everyone heals though). Sabin only does Phantom Rush or the Wind Attack, Locke is X Attack, Edgar is Jump or maybe Chainsaw, Shadow is Throw, Gau and Umaro are on autopilot, etc. The game really shines then. Pheonix Cave and Kefka's tower also bring this out on lower level plays. I don't find the gameplay weak at all. I find it varied and compelling with 14 characters which is why I replay it more than any other game.

I think another problem is that if you have Drill and are at the WoR, you can camp out in the desert south of Miranda and pick off Cactuars for 10 MP per battle without taking any damage. Get some earth absorbing armor and vanish and you can pick off the worms for 5MP and 5k XP without a ton of issue as well.

There are things you could do to make the game a bit harder without upsetting the balance too much. Make Wall Rings unpurchaseable, make X-Magic so it allows a specific spell to be cast once, disallow Vanish casting on enemies by player characters, things like that.

0

03.28.2013 2:30am

kjonez
with a Z

Well I was speaking more towards the story and character developing aspect of the games and how VI is a good benchmark for SE. I do feel that the battle system was superb for its time though and works very well for the game itself.

0

03.28.2013 2:35am

Soul Hunter
Ambitious but rubbish
Administrator

Remake FFVI using FFXIII technology. Problem solved. SQEX takes over the universe.

0

03.28.2013 3:05am

Fuuko Sakurada
Momoia =D

Soul Hunter said:

Remake FFVI using FFXIII technology. Problem solved. SQEX takes over the universe.

This. THIS. Caps lock. With cream on top or whatever you like ;-;

BoA*

Best of Asia * since 2000

0

03.28.2013 3:20am

ManjiSanji
Insanity Mongoose

I have no doubt that would look terrible.

I absolutely loathe the new art style. I do not want to think of FF6 looking like that. It would be a hard thing to translate and look right.

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